A Note Regarding Excess Crowns

JovethJoveth Member, Administrator, Moderator, Boss Fight
edited April 2016 in The Guild Hall
Hey everyone,

Thanks for all the feedback regarding the Guild Tournament system and the changes that we’ve been making over the past few months. Just to recap, we recently implemented a cap of 210 crowns per player in a guild with a max accumulation of 10,500 crowns that count towards tournament rewards. However, we’ve noticed that some players have been able to accumulate more than 210 crowns a week (which is an unintended user behavior and is actively discouraged) and as a result, we will be implementing a cap of crowns per player every week going forward. What this means is that no player should be able to retain anything beyond 30 extra crowns per week. We’ve had to include a 30 crown buffer due to the way crowns are counted in certain countries and time zones and we want to make sure those folks aren’t penalized.

So, what does this mean? Going forward, any crowns over 240 will be removed from players at the end of the tournament. The number of Crowns allowed per player to count towards tournament rewards is still 210, so that doesn’t change. We’re just capping any excess rollover crowns to 30. This is a short term solution, and we’ve got bigger plans to expand and improve guilds in the future. Thanks for being patient with us, and thanks for playing Dungeon Boss!
Post edited by Joel on

Comments

  • PrezObamaPrezObama Member
    edited March 2016
    FYI, not stickied in Recent Discussions. Thanks for the update!
    Post edited by PrezObama on
    9Ahi08z.jpg
  • VkwVkw Member
    Sylfae wrote: »
    As you've mentioned, this is a short term fix, but I'd hardly call it a solution. I hope you do realise that this is still a cosmetic patch that does nothing to fix the root of the problem.

    To this point, it doesn't really fix anything. The exploit can still be used midweek to make up any missed days of quests. Unfortunately, nothing is fixed here, you just won't see the issue on Mondays like you do currently.
  • GimceGimce Member
    edited March 2016
    Eh it'something. Plz continue to look into a way to fix the problem for good.
  • Not sure what the point of allowing excess crowns is in the first place aside from being allowed to miss a day's quests(through a time zone exploit). Correct me if I'm wrong.
  • VkwVkw Member
    Why not just put everyone on the same timer as when guild tournament ends? You would have weird ending times around the globe (10am, 3pm, 4am, whatever), but it'd be the same every day and they could plan accordingly. Then you could eliminate the carry over. Travelers would need to know that as they travel they're tied to a single time zone, but it's already this way for so many other things in game. This eliminates the time zone bug and carry over issue at once.

    Some might be stifled by this, but since it's a 24 hour period regardless (say 10am to 10am) it still gives everyone the same hours to complete quests. What other issues might exist this route?
  • TherrinnTherrinn Member, Dungeon Boss Guru, Volunteer Moderator
    @Vkw That is another possible solution that has been brought up on the forums before. The devs likely have a reason for the solution they have chosen, and it's possible that changing the quest reset for guild quests would be more complicated and error prone than we would expect. At the very least, it would potentially impact more code than just adding a carry-over cap, since it would require touching code that handles the other daily quests.

    For now, I plan to wait patiently and see what they have in store for the guild system as a whole.
    OverrideB1
    “I bought a big bag of potatoes and it's growing eyes like crazy. Other foods rot. Potatoes want to see.”
    ― Bill Callahan, Letters to Emma Bowlcut
  • FoxboxesFoxboxes Member
    edited March 2016
    Once again, Thank You Joveth, for the response and acknowledgement to the issue that has been plaguing the game for months now, whether you or anyone else at Boss Fight were aware of it, I have no idea, and that's irrelevant now anyways.

    I'm simply happy that something is going to be done to circumvent the issue and I'm also very impressed by the overwhelming support to resolve this issue by the numerous others here on the forums. - (Thanks to many of you for adding your opinions/suggestions/what-have-you's to the original thread and thanks to those who supported me personally in pushing the issue as well.)


    Now that's over with: I am glad that the temporary fix is going to be implemented. Though, since it is not a long term solution, It simply makes me optimistic towards the upcoming changes/improvements/features to Guilds. (:

    ---
    Vkw wrote: »
    Why not just put everyone on the same timer as when guild tournament ends? You would have weird ending times around the globe (10am, 3pm, 4am, whatever), but it'd be the same every day and they could plan accordingly. ..... This eliminates the time zone bug and carry over issue at once. ..... but since it's a 24 hour period regardless (say 10am to 10am) it still gives everyone the same hours to complete quests.

    I couldn't agree more, @Vkw. I prefer a singular reset time (as well as a player cap of 30 crowns within a 24hr period) over the current system.

    ---
    Therrinn wrote: »
    The devs likely have a reason for the solution they have chosen, and it's possible that changing the quest reset for guild quests would be more complicated and error prone than we would expect. At the very least, it would potentially impact more code than just adding a carry-over cap, since it would require touching code that handles the other daily quests.

    Valid point. @therrinn

    ---
    DeäthWish wrote: »
    We are a community of devout Dungeon Boss gamers after all and while there may be a lot of noise, some of us are genuinely wanting to assist you guys do the right thing.

    Agreed & well put! @DeäthWish
    DB%20Synchro%20Sig%20Fox%20Paladin%20Aug-01-01_zps1kp61yun.png
    Guildmaster 2.0 of Synchronicity
  • Add a Option for midweek join player to earn the Crowns from the left days ... !?
    LINE MESSENGER: exoofox
    www.PHÖNIX.com
    exoofox
  • FoxboxesFoxboxes Member
    edited March 2016
    ExoOFox wrote: »
    Add a Option for midweek join player to earn the Crowns from the left days ... !?

    I don't think we'll ever see something like that. Safe to assume it's part of the assumed responsibility of players leaving/joining mid-week.

    We try to secure as direct of a line of communication as possible with our guildies. - and I'm sure you do similarly. It's best to make it a request that if somebody does choose to leave, to do so on the next possible Monday - in the case that you don't do that already. @ExoOFox

    EDIT; Speak of the devil... We've just had someone leave midweek. Haha - time to replace and continue on.
    DB%20Synchro%20Sig%20Fox%20Paladin%20Aug-01-01_zps1kp61yun.png
    Guildmaster 2.0 of Synchronicity
  • The leaving midweek issue could easily be fixed by any crowns earnt for a guild stay with the guild regardless if a member leaves. It's not an impossible solution and an easy fix that means 49 other players don't have to suffer for 1 players selfishness. I understand that this could also encourage guilds to let go of and recruit players at any given time but if the crowns stayed with the guild no harm done in that area at least.
  • nunyanunya Member
    @Sylfae I actually think that's a great option. Whoever leaves loses the crowns. It's fair, wouldn't punish the guild for a player walking, and would make a kicked player with crowns more desirable to other guilds mid-week.
    nunya
  • Sylfae wrote: »
    blinkonce wrote: »
    The leaving midweek issue could easily be fixed by any crowns earnt for a guild stay with the guild regardless if a member leaves. It's not an impossible solution and an easy fix that means 49 other players don't have to suffer for 1 players selfishness. I understand that this could also encourage guilds to let go of and recruit players at any given time but if the crowns stayed with the guild no harm done in that area at least.

    One solution to that - if the player leaves, the crowns stay with the guild. If the player is kicked, the crowns go with the player. Though there may be other side effects to this, gotta think it through first.

    This would be make for complicated/convoluted solutions to "what if"s.

    What if somebody leaves on Monday after getting their crowns (so the guild keeps their 30), then the guild immediately recruit somebody else who was kicked and holds 30 crowns.
    Now the guild has 60 crowns in for that one 'slot'. Of course, the situation is amplified if the same thing occurred on a Sunday.

    Now imagine that different people were doing this with different amounts of crowns - it quickly gets complicated to say what you should do to solve this.
  • Gmanju wrote: »
    Crowns are tied to a slot. So if someone leaves on monday and has a fresh player join then his slot will show 30/210 and will not increase until his individual crown count also goes over 30. There is the fix for every situation.

    First- you're going to hit the usual problems of "what if somebody is in a different time zone?". At what point does the 30-daily-limit change over to a 60-daily-limit?
    You might think that's obvious - increase the limit when that specific individual gets new crown quests. But what if somebody smashes their quests as soon as they're refreshed, and then they leave the guild? Imagine they leave Tuesday morning and leave the 'slot' with 60 crowns, then a new person joins on their Monday evening and takes the 60-crown slot.
    Because it's their Monday evening, they should be limited to 30 crowns. But they have 60 in their slot! Do you reduce the crowns down to 30? What if you do that, reduce them to 30, and then that person just leaves again - the guild just lost 30 crowns from somebody leaving!

    Second even this solution will in some cases still end up with some guild losing crowns. Consider;

    Two people leave, first one has 20 and second one has 10.
    Somebody joins with 20 crowns.
    Later, somebody joins with 10 crowns.

    If you say "first arriver takes the slot of the first leaver", guild has lost ten crowns.
    If you go "first arriver takes the slot of the last leaver", then you're fine. Except the next time it happens, when the person with 10 crowns join first - then you end up losing ten crowns just the other way around.

    You can try to come up with a 'rule' which satisfies this exact scenario, but it's unlikely your tailored 'rule' will work with another scenario (if you think of a solution, try it with more examples - like 15/10 joiners and leavers, and joiners and leavers who have completely different numbers of crowns).

    Sorry this is a bit of a confusing post, but in short - the exact way the rules have to work if you want everything to be fair ends up getting really convoluted and difficult to write clearly. Unless you stick with the fact that "in some cases, people will just end up losing some crowns" - but that'll just draw more complaints.
  • I find the "time zone" debate rather puzzling. Last time I checked a day is 24 hours no matter where you live.
  • nunyanunya Member
    @Shtanky depends upon which planet. I think that's the basic issue. Developers are from Mars and players are from Venus. ;)
    nunya
  • TherrinnTherrinn Member, Dungeon Boss Guru, Volunteer Moderator
    @Nunya I don't want to have a daily refresh on Venus. There are 2802 Earth hours per Venusian day.
    OverrideB1
    “I bought a big bag of potatoes and it's growing eyes like crazy. Other foods rot. Potatoes want to see.”
    ― Bill Callahan, Letters to Emma Bowlcut
  • nunyanunya Member
    Okay. - how about Jupiter? 9 hours 55 min and about 30 seconds. :)
    nunya
  • Y'all make me LOL.
    DB%20Synchro%20Sig%20Fox%20Paladin%20Aug-01-01_zps1kp61yun.png
    Guildmaster 2.0 of Synchronicity
  • hplchplc Member
    Are you also able to max crowns to 30 per day?
    hplc
  • GimceGimce Member
    Nope, you can still go beyond that funny enough
  • Seems simple enough to allow crowns to stay with the guild, but require you to be in a guild at quest reset to get guild quests and have guild quests disappear when leaving a guild.

    This way when you join on Thursday to replace someone that turned in 50 crowns and left midweek, the 50 stays with the guild and the replacement player can not provide crowns on day 1, but can turn in 30 per day for the rest of the week.

    This will penalize people who change guilds by capping availible crowns at 180 for the change week, but isn't loyalty to a home guild something to be rewarded?
    More importantly, this would prevent people using the changing of guild members to unfairly affect the tourney results while not penalizing the whole guild for one player quitting the game or changing guilds.

    There should also be a 10k reward level that would close the gap between the top 10 and top 50 in rewards.
  • HellaMHellaM Member
    How do guilds rankings work? We do 10500 crowns. How does one aim for the fiest place and 35 Hagrim Felhorn tokens? The guild that gets the crowns fastest? Has the most overall points? Guilds have bad communication tools and are not explained at all on top of everything.
  • If you get 10.5, you will get first. Multiple guilds get first,
    Gorgons have a new guild! Gormandizing gorgon! Yaya!!!
Sign In or Register to comment.

© 2015 Big Fish Games. Inc., Big Fish, the Big Fish logo, and Dungeon Boss are
trademarks of Big Fish Games, Inc., used with permission www.bigfishgames.com