When is the number 13 lucky? When it's added as the new final step in Rune Tuning!

EejEej Member, Administrator, Moderator, Boss Fight
Howdy all,

We'll be doing an update shortly that has two significant changes to Rune Crafting/Tuning.

First, we're adding an additional Tune attempt - #13 - that guarantees Legendary rarity for a sizable gem cost.
  • Lesser: 60 gems
  • Improved: 300 gems
  • Greater: 780 gems
  • Superior: 1140 gems

Second, we've adjusted the behavior of "bonus" per tune such that when you do get a Success in Rarity - it no longer resets the "bonus" progress.

Example: If I am on attempt 5 while at Rare going to Heroic when it succeeds, I will start as if I was on attempt 6 tuning towards Legendary in terms of bonus chance to succeed. Previously, a successful Rarity improvement would restart "bonus" progress back to step 1.

Net result is Legendary success happens more often even before the 13th step.

Enjoy - and tune responsibly!
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Comments

  • nunyanunya Member
    @Eej Are you guaranteed 5 stars also ?
    nunya
  • Eej wrote: »
    Howdy all,

    We'll be doing an update shortly that has two significant changes to Rune Crafting/Tuning.

    First, we're adding an additional Tune attempt - #13 - that guarantees Legendary rarity for a sizable gem cost.
    • Lesser: 60 gems
    • Improved: 300 gems
    • Greater: 780 gems
    • Superior: 1140 gems

    Second, we've adjusted the behavior of "bonus" per tune such that when you do get a Success in Rarity - it no longer resets the "bonus" progress.

    Example: If I am on attempt 5 while at Rare going to Heroic when it succeeds, I will start as if I was on attempt 6 tuning towards Legendary in terms of bonus chance to succeed. Previously, a successful Rarity improvement would restart "bonus" progress back to step 1.

    Net result is Legendary success happens more often even before the 13th step.

    Enjoy - and tune responsibly!

    Thank you. This is definitely a welcomed change! Especially from all the crap that happened over the past couple weeks.
  • FlyteFlyte Member
    How many "confirm" buttons do we have to press before the transaction gets processed...?
  • Thanks Eej. Looking forward to testing this.
    Contact me on Line chat ID: ninjanurse00
  • Might as well just hand out superior legendary runes to all new players with the completion of each PVE chapter. Selling superior legendary runes in honor shop? Now allowing runes to reach legendary status even easier and even GUARANTEEING legendary status for a gem price?

    What's next? Being able to buy superior legendary runes with stamina?

    Each update seems to make the game easier and easier, and this makes all the effort made by veterans to achieve their current status feel completely devalued.

    In a few months, people will have reaped enough PvP runes so that everyone's PvP defense and attack roster would look the same.

    Being able to purchase a superior legendary rune is just insulting to anyone who had to struggle to climb their way into top 100.

    What's the point of even reaching top 100 these days if some dude raiding all easy matches can get one also?

    IMO, the superior legendary rune from honor shop should be changed to a heroic superior. That way, the boss 100 rune still holds even a tiny little bit of prestige.

  • This is great change to counter the frustration of RNG for tuning runes, in my assessment. I could be proven wrong, but at a basic look, it seems promising.
  • I can't even imagine how someone like Dane feels having acquired all his runes through trashing hundreds of heroic runes before landing a few legendaries, only to discover now the new generation of players can get similar runes as him for a tiny fraction of the effort/cost.

    Even more infuriating for people who slave away at boss 100 learning all the counters for every defense in PvP to find out a guildie with a terrible roster is getting the same rune as him by raiding easy matches.

    @Eej Are you sure that making the game easier and easier is really beneficial to the game's long-term success?
  • oredithoredith Member
    DB_Master wrote: »
    Being able to purchase a superior legendary rune is just insulting to anyone who had to struggle to climb their way into top 100.
    this must be the first MMO type game you have ever played? this happens to literally every single game ever.

    it's called "welfare epics". the people who fought hard to get them first enjoy a time of dominance before the rest is allowed a much easier path, which keeps the players in game, which pays the bills for them to come out with new content for the end-gamers to conquer.
    soon™ - it's the answer to everything
  • oredith wrote: »
    DB_Master wrote: »
    Being able to purchase a superior legendary rune is just insulting to anyone who had to struggle to climb their way into top 100.
    this must be the first MMO type game you have ever played? this happens to literally every single game ever.

    it's called "welfare epics". the people who fought hard to get them first enjoy a time of dominance before the rest is allowed a much easier path, which keeps the players in game, which pays the bills for them to come out with new content for the end-gamers to conquer.

    Was about to post the same thing. Any time new content/expansions are released, it makes prior gear obsolete. In this case, I'm guessing DB will release new content and there was talk of a new rune tier as well. Maybe the new rune above superior will not benefit from the current rune system.

    Either, the point is that over time, the best players reach a ceiling while the rest of the players catch up to them. Then new content is released, the ceiling raised, and you repeat this whole thing over again.
  • So is the update out or not? I haven't seen a "DB Got better" message yet.
  • shiggity80 wrote: »
    So is the update out or not? I haven't seen a "DB Got better" message yet.

    It is not. I stupidly crafted a superior while not really paying attention to the timing and realized 9 tunes in when it finally went to heroic that the bar reset to zero because the update wasn't out yet. I hate myself sometimes.
  • nunyanunya Member
    @Skip_Holmes ouch. Sorry :(
    nunya
  • DB_MasterDB_Master Member
    edited June 28
    oredith wrote: »
    DB_Master wrote: »
    Being able to purchase a superior legendary rune is just insulting to anyone who had to struggle to climb their way into top 100.
    this must be the first MMO type game you have ever played? this happens to literally every single game ever.

    it's called "welfare epics". the people who fought hard to get them first enjoy a time of dominance before the rest is allowed a much easier path, which keeps the players in game, which pays the bills for them to come out with new content for the end-gamers to conquer.

    Nah, I've played Runescape and Maplestory. EOC destroyed Runescape, and Maplestory is now so far gone down the trash, you could probably count their playerbase on both your hands.

    Oldschool Runescape now thrives without this concept of "welfare epics". Having people struggle immensely in the beginning, then releasing significantly easier methods ALWAYS leaves the veterans feeling disappointed.

    I'd enjoy the idea of raising the ceilings without making current content significantly easier before that happens.

    Look what happened to Maplestory: it used to take weeks to reach level 30. Now you can reach level 200 in a few days. And now their playerbase is as empty as ever.
  • EejEej Member, Administrator, Moderator, Boss Fight
    Public service announcement - wrap up any runes still in-progress (e.g. force closing the app to escape the tuning without accepting).

    A rune that was "stored" in this way pre-update - won't properly get the 13th step guarantee. All runes started AFTER the update will work fine.
  • DB_MasterDB_Master Member
    edited June 28
    I, for one, enjoy having very challenging content. It gives value to what we work so hard to achieve. Making what I do now significantly easier to achieve every few months down the line only makes you question why you're working so hard at it in the first place. Would you mine coal for $10/hr if you found out your coworker could pick his nose and surf around on Reddit for the same pay a couple months down the road?

    Hell no.

    I still enjoy the game, but god **** is it annoying to see that so many of my guild members are just simply buying a superior legendary rune off the shelf and bragging about it without being anywhere close to top 100.
  • BokiDahBokiDah Member
    So... spend more money, buy more gems, get guaranteed legendary runes. Hmmm, how else can we widen the gap?
  • oredithoredith Member
    BokiDah wrote: »
    So... spend more money, buy more gems, get guaranteed legendary runes. Hmmm, how else can we widen the gap?
    spoiler alert - whenever games make the most desired loot more widely available, it's almost always followed by the release of better stuff a short time later.

    this will probably actually narrow the gap with easier to get legendary while the end gamers are getting some super-duper-superior runes.
    soon™ - it's the answer to everything
  • kalamadeakalamadea Member
    edited June 28
    Eej wrote: »
    Public service announcement - wrap up any runes still in-progress (e.g. force closing the app to escape the tuning without accepting).

    A rune that was "stored" in this way pre-update - won't properly get the 13th step guarantee. All runes started AFTER the update will work fine.

    Thanks for the info Eej... but could you take a brief moment to respond to the concerns about Tsume's lackluster epic? Or acknowledge that you're okay with his epic actually making him worse in PVP? @Eej


  • JackHallow666JackHallow666 Member, Dungeon Boss Guru, Volunteer Moderator
    DB_Master wrote: »
    I can't even imagine how someone like Dane feels having acquired all his runes through trashing hundreds of heroic runes before landing a few legendaries, only to discover now the new generation of players can get similar runes as him for a tiny fraction of the effort/cost.

    Even more infuriating for people who slave away at boss 100 learning all the counters for every defense in PvP to find out a guildie with a terrible roster is getting the same rune as him by raiding easy matches.

    @Eej Are you sure that making the game easier and easier is really beneficial to the game's long-term success?

    Lol, of course it does. You just said it helps newer players. Meaning people won't be so intimidated by Runes and Epics and all that stuff coming into the game now. Meaning more players will pick the game up and keep playing.
    And why are you upset? It's not like it makes the game easier for newbies only. Makes it easier for you, too. In fact it probably helps paying players more than anyone cuz they have the gems to burn on this new 13th tune.

    Imagine it like the extreme difficulty it used to take to make Legendary Superior Runes was never intentional, they wanted it to be easier but didn't know how. And now they do. You gotta look at it from a newbie's perspective. The game is now better and more welcoming than it was before this update. For you, although you had a harder time making your legendary Runes, you nonetheless HAVE those legendary Runes. Runes that the newbies don't. You'll always be a step ahead, so why complain?
    Level: 70
    Favorite hero: Bovus
    Favorite element: Nature
    Currently: Trying to max out Epics
  • JackHallow666JackHallow666 Member, Dungeon Boss Guru, Volunteer Moderator
    Also, if you happen to roll a 5* Legendary BEFORE using up the normal 12 rolls (let's say you got it there at roll 7), will the "13th roll" now be available, or will you keep having to basically waste gems until you're on roll 13?
    Level: 70
    Favorite hero: Bovus
    Favorite element: Nature
    Currently: Trying to max out Epics
  • JackHallow666JackHallow666 Member, Dungeon Boss Guru, Volunteer Moderator
    Or will there not even be a 13th roll at all? If it becomes 5* Legendary and doesn't get a bonus effect (damage vs Undead, etc) will you still have to keep rolling?
    Level: 70
    Favorite hero: Bovus
    Favorite element: Nature
    Currently: Trying to max out Epics
  • DB_Master wrote: »
    I can't even imagine how someone like Dane feels having acquired all his runes through trashing hundreds of heroic runes before landing a few legendaries, only to discover now the new generation of players can get similar runes as him for a tiny fraction of the effort/cost.

    Even more infuriating for people who slave away at boss 100 learning all the counters for every defense in PvP to find out a guildie with a terrible roster is getting the same rune as him by raiding easy matches.

    @Eej Are you sure that making the game easier and easier is really beneficial to the game's long-term success?

    Lol, of course it does. You just said it helps newer players. Meaning people won't be so intimidated by Runes and Epics and all that stuff coming into the game now. Meaning more players will pick the game up and keep playing.
    And why are you upset? It's not like it makes the game easier for newbies only. Makes it easier for you, too. In fact it probably helps paying players more than anyone cuz they have the gems to burn on this new 13th tune.

    Imagine it like the extreme difficulty it used to take to make Legendary Superior Runes was never intentional, they wanted it to be easier but didn't know how. And now they do. You gotta look at it from a newbie's perspective. The game is now better and more welcoming than it was before this update. For you, although you had a harder time making your legendary Runes, you nonetheless HAVE those legendary Runes. Runes that the newbies don't. You'll always be a step ahead, so why complain?

    That's like asking a straight A student why they're mad that the teacher has made the test significantly easier for others. Veterans struggled to get all the runes we have now, and now the process of acquiring legendaries (which is just one part of the problem) is now much easier. I'm actually not as annoyed by this new tuning regime as I am about the fact that new players can now BUY the Boss 100 rune.

    I highly doubt that being able to craft and acquire very powerful runes is necessarily going to attract more players than however much they're attracting now. If anything, veteran players feel demotivated to continue playing a hacked-up game while new guys play for awhile, and realize their efforts are being devalued as well, leading to a vicious cycle of players that won't stick around for long.

    Maplestory now allows you to reach max level thousands of times faster than it took people just a couple years ago. Their playerbase? About 1% of what it was in 2010.
  • Loving the update. Got two superior planning runes for less than 2k gems total. Granted one was a 5% rune but still.
  • NobodyPiNobodyPi Member
    Or will there not even be a 13th roll at all? If it becomes 5* Legendary and doesn't get a bonus effect (damage vs Undead, etc) will you still have to keep rolling?

    I think (but have not confirmed) that 13th roll does not guarantee a bonus effect.
  • DB_Master wrote: »
    Might as well just hand out superior legendary runes to all new players with the completion of each PVE chapter. Selling superior legendary runes in honor shop? Now allowing runes to reach legendary status even easier and even GUARANTEEING legendary status for a gem price?

    What's next? Being able to buy superior legendary runes with stamina?

    Each update seems to make the game easier and easier, and this makes all the effort made by veterans to achieve their current status feel completely devalued.

    In a few months, people will have reaped enough PvP runes so that everyone's PvP defense and attack roster would look the same.

    Being able to purchase a superior legendary rune is just insulting to anyone who had to struggle to climb their way into top 100.

    What's the point of even reaching top 100 these days if some dude raiding all easy matches can get one also?

    IMO, the superior legendary rune from honor shop should be changed to a heroic superior. That way, the boss 100 rune still holds even a tiny little bit of prestige.

    Power Creep. Happens to every MMO ever.
  • DB_MasterDB_Master Member
    edited June 29
    Saying legendary superior runes were "hard" to get is pretty comical. I suppose if you handed me a dice and said roll a 4 or higher you'd call that difficult content as well?

    This is a GREAT change for the game.

    There is literally NO skill involved in acquiring runes. No talent. No difficulty. The only thing that takes an ounce of skill in this game is bringing the right team to the job in pvp but even that is more a game in memorization. All this does is even the playing field for more players so they actually have a shot at showing that ounce of skill this game demands. Without these runes they aren't even allowed in the arena.

    Top 100 player: Very very happy.

    Yeah man, running those Boss Islands tens or hundreds of times to gather superior shards is like autorunning chapter 1 with furnace. I can't believe I missed out on the daily free superior shard package that the devs were able to hook you up specifically with. I can't believe Dane was also able to average 4 dice rolls for a superior legendary on all his runes.

    Where the heck was I when they slashed the 25k honor pricing for superior shards in the honor shop by 99% when you were around?

    I can't believe that doing the tower multiple more times to be able to fully tune a superior rune is the exact same difficulty as fully tuning a lesser rune.

    It's all the same, right Matty?
  • phontonxphontonx Member
    Any chance for a free rune unequip with this update?! @Eej
    10328949?gid=

  • MattCauthronMattCauthron Member
    edited June 29
    Oh you're Matsuda. It all makes sense now. @Joel Can we take care of his 4th account?
  • DB_MasterDB_Master Member
    edited June 29
    Oh you're Matsuda. It all makes sense now. @Joel Can we take care of his 4th account?

    Relax, young man. You are not the holy prophet of Egypt. You need to realize there is more than 1 person on the forums who doesn't completely agree with you on all your points.

    I am making fair claims without being disrespectul or hurling insults. There's no reasonable excuse to compromise my account in any way, shape, or form.

    Simply defend your position, and let's get this ball rolling.

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