Zomminion stats

Can anyone explain how a zomminion gets his stats? is it a portion of the stats from the person he came from? or is it a portion of the stats from zomm himself? Is it purely random?

In my experience the archers and casters seem to hit really hard, while the tanks and healers seem to be weaker in their stats. My guess is because the archers tend to be from shade and SB while the tanks and healers are usually there as my 4th person fodder.

Comments

  • JackHallow666JackHallow666 Member, Dungeon Boss Guru, Volunteer Moderator
    As far as I’ve heard, they mimick Zomm’s stats precisely. Perhaps their abilities scale with their stats differently. For example, normally, all heroes’ basic attacks deal 49.5% of their Atk stat in damage (besides Furnace). For whatever reason it won’t update the damage to match your runes, but that’s besdie the point.

    All abilities that deal damage scale with some % of the hero’s Attack stat. Perhaps to make it appear like the Zomminions have varying strengths, they tweaked this usual 49.5% to be either higher or lower for each class of Zomminion. They probably toyed with their abilities’ stats as well, I’d imagine.

    I only suspect this because I’ve noticed their damages vary, as you’ve said, but it seems they all have the same amount of Health and Defense, something that would be a bit harder to program to change.

    Maybe @Joel could clear this up? Tell us how Zomm’s stats relate to his Zomminions and, if they have changed the ability scaling percentages, tell us what they are.
    Level: 70
    Favorite hero: Hansuke
    Currently: Waiting for new PvE content and the PvP revamp.
  • As far as I’ve heard, they mimick Zomm’s stats precisely. Perhaps their abilities scale with their stats differently. For example, normally, all heroes’ basic attacks deal 49.5% of their Atk stat in damage (besides Furnace). For whatever reason it won’t update the damage to match your runes, but that’s besdie the point.

    All abilities that deal damage scale with some % of the hero’s Attack stat. Perhaps to make it appear like the Zomminions have varying strengths, they tweaked this usual 49.5% to be either higher or lower for each class of Zomminion. They probably toyed with their abilities’ stats as well, I’d imagine.

    I only suspect this because I’ve noticed their damages vary, as you’ve said, but it seems they all have the same amount of Health and Defense, something that would be a bit harder to program to change.

    Maybe @Joel could clear this up? Tell us how Zomm’s stats relate to his Zomminions and, if they have changed the ability scaling percentages, tell us what they are.

    Working hypothesis in FB is that the runes carry over from the corpse the minion replaces.
    If that's the case, the stats don't matter nearly so much, since they're base Zomm or other hero stats.
    This is probably true, I had my bauble ohko by ace's minion from his shade.
    There's no way a zomm-statted minion would be able to do that to my dr bauble.
  • JackHallow666JackHallow666 Member, Dungeon Boss Guru, Volunteer Moderator
    danac wrote: »
    As far as I’ve heard, they mimick Zomm’s stats precisely. Perhaps their abilities scale with their stats differently. For example, normally, all heroes’ basic attacks deal 49.5% of their Atk stat in damage (besides Furnace). For whatever reason it won’t update the damage to match your runes, but that’s besdie the point.

    All abilities that deal damage scale with some % of the hero’s Attack stat. Perhaps to make it appear like the Zomminions have varying strengths, they tweaked this usual 49.5% to be either higher or lower for each class of Zomminion. They probably toyed with their abilities’ stats as well, I’d imagine.

    I only suspect this because I’ve noticed their damages vary, as you’ve said, but it seems they all have the same amount of Health and Defense, something that would be a bit harder to program to change.

    Maybe @Joel could clear this up? Tell us how Zomm’s stats relate to his Zomminions and, if they have changed the ability scaling percentages, tell us what they are.

    Working hypothesis in FB is that the runes carry over from the corpse the minion replaces.
    If that's the case, the stats don't matter nearly so much, since they're base Zomm or other hero stats.
    This is probably true, I had my bauble ohko by ace's minion from his shade.
    There's no way a zomm-statted minion would be able to do that to my dr bauble.

    I dunno. Zomm's have pretty high attack. Mine's at 5.5k. Also, a Shade would (or at least, should) become a Caster Zomminion, meaning he ignores a lot of Bauble's DR. That high attack combined with the ability to ignore all of Bauble's natural DR passives could definitely call for a OHKO.
    Level: 70
    Favorite hero: Hansuke
    Currently: Waiting for new PvE content and the PvP revamp.
  • My Zomm hits like a wet noodle, but some of his minion don't.
  • I’m sure @Foozle will have it figured out soon.
  • I find the minions tend to hit harder then the corpse they came from and are harder to kill as well
  • They are slow...
  • bvs72 wrote: »
    I’m sure @Foozle will have it figured out soon.

    I did some testing and it appears that when the corpse is not removed by an enemy, that the zomminion picks up the stats of the hero that died. He becomes undead, however, so instead of whatever elemental bonus he had when alive, he picks up the dark elemental bonus. The zomminion also loses any other special passives he may have had when alive and picks up any of the undead passives granted by Zomm or other allied heroes.

    I wasn't able to test yet what happens if the corpse is removed from play. I would need to get some good sample battles from a PvP match to do that, and it is harder to test since the battles are so short. We know at least that the type of zomminion that appears is random in these cases (tank, caster, etc.), but it is hard to tell where the stats would come from. It could be they get Zomm's stats, the original hero stats or some other arbitrary stats based on unknown factors (modified for their class).

    I'll keep watching for good PvP battles to see if I can get better data when the corpse is removed.
  • Foozle you are giving away all the secrets, feel free to watch my replays as I have a very zomminion heavy strategy
  • ace_1650cp wrote: »
    Foozle you are giving away all the secrets, feel free to watch my replays as I have a very zomminion heavy strategy

    I thought your strategy was to put massive runes on your heroes and roll over everybody.
  • Total Zomminionation.
  • JackHallow666JackHallow666 Member, Dungeon Boss Guru, Volunteer Moderator

    Yes, but the problem is there's some things that don't add up/weren't discussed with your page. For instance, if their stats really are purely reflected from Zomm's, why are some of the Zomminion types doing more or less damage than others? Do they copy his stats, his rune stats, or both? Is ability damage scaling the same with all the Zomminions? If not, what are the exact numbers?
    Level: 70
    Favorite hero: Hansuke
    Currently: Waiting for new PvE content and the PvP revamp.
  • Maybe each Zomminion has it's own base stats and the stats form Zomm's runes get added to that, this could be the reason why they do different amounts of damage.
  • FoozleFoozle Member
    edited November 16

    Sorry, didn't see until just now. I didn't test the fourth rune stat aspect you mentioned, so can't comment one way or the other on that. However, at least when the corpse isn't removed, it does appear that the stats are based on the original hero rather than Zomm.

    The test I did involved running Zomm (fully runed), Sir William (no runes), and Phemus (fully runed). Zomm's attack rating was 5390, Phemus was 3764 and Sir William was 1755. I ran the same PvE dungeon repeatedly to get consistent data by attacking the same type/level mob. Before any minions appeared, Zomm was doing (non critical) damage of about 3100 per attack, Phemus was at 1500 and Sir William at 310.

    After Phemus and William were turned in to minions, their damage on normal attacks remained generally the same as before they were minions. Phemus was still around 1500 and William around 430 (more due to getting benefit from becoming a slow hero). At least in PvE, and when the corpse is not removed, it appears that Zomm's stats don't affect the minions. It could be that in PvP things are different, but I haven't tested. It could also be that Zomm 4th rune stats play a part, but again I haven't personally tested.
    Post edited by Foozle on
  • I find the minions tend to hit harder then the corpse they came from and are harder to kill as well

    i have this much at least confirmed in video, when a horribly bad william was replaced with a zomminion who did like 10X the damage.
    www.youtube.com/DarthCraig
    www.twitter.com/Darth_Craig

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  • ckall056 wrote: »
    I find the minions tend to hit harder then the corpse they came from and are harder to kill as well

    i have this much at least confirmed in video, when a horribly bad william was replaced with a zomminion who did like 10X the damage.

    Was William's corpse removed before he was turned into a minion?
  • Foozle, have you tried using a very heavily attack rune tank to see if he does a lot of damage? it seems like the tank zominions have no attack.
  • Foozle wrote: »
    ckall056 wrote: »
    I find the minions tend to hit harder then the corpse they came from and are harder to kill as well

    i have this much at least confirmed in video, when a horribly bad william was replaced with a zomminion who did like 10X the damage.

    Was William's corpse removed before he was turned into a minion?

    it was not removed - it was a boss mode dungeon - basic beastie type enemy
    www.youtube.com/DarthCraig
    www.twitter.com/Darth_Craig

    Are all plugs shameless?
  • Zommnions definitely use zomms runes because I just had an enemy get set on fire when attacking my zomminion and my lord zomm has a rune with burning skin
  • Kegman913 wrote: »
    Foozle, have you tried using a very heavily attack rune tank to see if he does a lot of damage? it seems like the tank zominions have no attack.

    Well, in my test I had two tanks - Phemus and William. Phemus's attack was about double William's and Phemus did triple the damage that William did. That is why I think at least the attack stat is not taken from Zomm. Sounding more and more like fourth stats are taken from Zomm, at least based on the two observations of burning skin and poison.

    Sounds like we may need to do a bit more testing to see what is happening as there appears to be inconsistencies.
  • ScoutYoScoutYo Member
    edited November 15
    I was experimenting with Zomm the other day in PvE. After my furnace (who has a haste rune) was killed, the Zomminion that replaced him got a haste proc. Nobody else on the team (including Zomm) had a haste rune, or any means of casting haste on a teammate.

    I've also had an Igorok Zomminion proc electric skin in PvP. Zomm doesn't have that on any rune, but Igo does. His body was not removed.

    Last night, my Shade was turned into a Zomminion in PvP (body not removed). The next round, the enemy Shade Possessed my (well-runed, heavy DR/Def) Hopper. The enemy Shade had been able to do very little damage to my Hopper throughout the the battle, despite having four Legendary Superior double attack runes. My own Shade's Zomminion was able to two-shot my possessed Hopper. My Shade also has four Legendary Superior double attack runes, but unlike my opponent's Shade, all four of mine have +15% damage vs rogues.* My Zomm was barely able to scratch my Hopper.

    In general, I've definitely seen a correlation (in both PvP and PVE) between my hero's attack and the replacement Zomminion's, at least when the body isn't removed.

    *Granted, I'm making an assumption, here. My opponent's runes were all crafted, not PvP reward runes.
    Post edited by ScoutYo on
  • ScoutYo wrote: »
    I was experimenting with Zomm the other day in PvE. After my furnace (who has a haste rune) was killed, the Zomminion that replaced him got a haste proc. Nobody else on the team (including Zomm) had a haste rune, or any mean of casting haste on a teammate.

    I've also had an Igorok Zomminion proc electric skin in PvP. Zomm doesn't have that on any rune, but Igo does. His body was not removed.

    Last night, my Shade was turned into a Zomminion in PvP (body not removed). The next round, the enemy Shade Possessed my (well-runed, heavy DR/Def) Hopper. The enemy Shade had been able to do very little damage to my Hopper throughout the the battle, despite having four Legendary Superior double attack runes. My own Shade's Zomminion was able to two-shot my possessed Hopper. My Shade also has four Legendary Superior double attack runes, but unlike my opponent's Shade, all four of mine have +15% damage vs rogues.* My Zomm was barely able to scratch my Hopper.

    In general, I've definitely seen a correlation (in both PvP and PVE) between my hero's attack and the replacement Zomminion's, at least when the body isn't removed.

    *Granted, I'm making an assumption, here. My opponent's runes were all crafted, not PvP reward runes.

    Great data! This is consistent with what I saw in PvE. We have inconsistencies in the 4th stat question now, because you are saying you see your minions getting the benefit of the 4th stat from the original hero, while two other say they saw the 4th stat from Zomm carrying over to the minion. I wouldn't think the minion would get the 4th stat from both the original and Zomm, but anything is possible. We just need a few more data points to confirm either way.
  • this is kind of a long shot but, could it be possible that minions take a mix of runes depending on color? Maybe they take some colors from zomm and some colors from the hero they replace?
  • FatCat69FatCat69 Member
    edited November 15
    I have seen a couple cases where Zomminions benefited from fourth traits -- specifically Burning Touch and Electric Skin. I believe the electric skin came off of one of the Yellow Champion, so wasn't on Zomm. The burning touch was inherited from Zomm's runes as he also burned my heroes with his attacks.

    In the first case (other defender's runes), the corpse hadn't been removed from play and the dead Solaris (I believe) was replaced with a Zomminion. In the second case (Zomm's runes), the corpse had been removed and so was a random class but generated with Zomm's runes in place.
  • I think we need some proof on the 4th stat zomm thing before worry too much about it! They 100% take their 'host' corpse 4th stats if corpse isn't removed.

    As has been shown here, from experience zomminions take stats from the 'host' corpse if it is not removed.

    They also do more damage with auto attacks than their original heroes in pvp at least due to being slow I believe this is boosting their stats like other slow heroes hence the results scoutyo was seeing.

    Also being undead and purple they benefit from no negative colour issues like red/blue green/red and benefit from some zomm / hansuke skills / buffs to boost their attack further.
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