PvP now harder and rewards less useful.

This is more of an observation than a complaint, but I'd be interested if anyone else was experiencing the same thing.

PvP is more difficult than it used to be. Mostly because PvP is now more interesting - more variation in defences - but it's also because there's a lot more Guardian and Survivor runes about. I now don't get the win streaks I used to. I've been in a number of weak guilds and have only one corrupted heart, and I quite often find three teams I just can't beat. There are a LOT of good defence teams out there.

For the first time in a long time I'm going to end up in Warlord I. The rune is therefore pretty much garbage. At this stage nearly everyone has a lot of good runes. For me, anything less then 249 isn't worth getting. But a rune without a 4th stat is useless. I have a lot of 249 runes unequipped.

I get thirty tokens than generates a minimal amount of aether that can be used to upgrade a sub-par hero (Aria)

I get 195 gems that I don't need because the heroic portal just gives me aether

I get 4 medals of honor, and I have 92 already.

So... What's the point? When PvP started the runes were invaluable, but now...

We've been doing these 'seasons of' for ages and for months it was all about fixing all the problems but now it just feels stale and unrewarding.

Would be great to hear from both those that agree and disagree. I like Dungeon Boss and don't like feeling that I'm beginning not to like Dungeon Boss...

Comments

  • MattCauthronMattCauthron Member
    edited December 2017
    There is only one reason to pvp.

    Perfectly rolled superior 5 star legendary runes.

    You can grind hard and get 3 a week (Abusing some shop refresh timing).
    You can grind only for top 100 and get 2 a week (60k honor and top 100 reward)
    You can grind low and get 1 a week (60k honor only)
    You can play casually and get 1 whenever you hit 60k honor

    Considering these runes roll with perfect stats, they are essentially the best runes you can get in the game. Until you have a roster full of perfectly runed superior legendaries... there's plenty of inventive to keep pvping.

  • @MattCauthron - care to elaborate on abusing shop refresh timing?
  • @MattCauthron **** - I get about 1 every 2 weeks! I think this also explains why I find it harder - more and more defences with perfect 280 runes. They are getting more than I am...

    It's kinda self defeating and on a negative feedback loop - I lose streaks because I'm offered defences that I can't beat, because they have better runes, meaning I get less honor, meaning the gap just widens.

  • bvs72 wrote: »
    @MattCauthron - care to elaborate on abusing shop refresh timing?

    He verbally abuses it by yelling at it, and physically abuses it by tapping on his screen really hard.
  • gradders wrote: »
    @MattCauthron **** - I get about 1 every 2 weeks! I think this also explains why I find it harder - more and more defences with perfect 280 runes. They are getting more than I am...

    It's kinda self defeating and on a negative feedback loop - I lose streaks because I'm offered defences that I can't beat, because they have better runes, meaning I get less honor, meaning the gap just widens.

    Don't worry man. I'm right there with you! Legend I and done :D I always try to get there with no losses but alas 81-2 this season. Better luck next one.
  • If some paradign were to change, like when runes first started, and these PvP runes also just started, there will still be a disparity and there will be the have's and have-nots.
    I remember not so long ago when the only way to get those amazing superiors was to buy a rune bag, which is a terrible idea, or get into the top 100.
    I was a "have-not", save for the few really nice superiors i crafted.
    THEN, the 60k honor rune came out...myself, and many others in Legend 1 now became super powers to behold.
    What was the effect? The floor on the top 100 sunk a bit and generally could include many more players that it dint before.
    Is anything different? Nope - there are just even more people creeping on the 5592 - one more chance for me to lose that streak.

    So be careful what you wish for - we can change up the rewards...perhaps add a +20% pvp rune. Guess what, if you're not one of the first to get it, you may be feeling the pain of fighting those who did.
    Then we start up the "You need to nerf PvP because there are impossible defenses!" or "How does a level 65 beat me so badly when I have 5592 defense?"

    The only changes I can see is with combat revamp, which may help remove the 1-shot meta of PvP. I seriously doubt it will, but having a PvP structure where you can make someone like Takumi or Selwyn useful is the only cure to our broken PvP system. Rewards will not change anything.
    www.youtube.com/DarthCraig
    www.twitter.com/Darth_Craig

    Are all plugs shameless?
  • MattCauthronMattCauthron Member
    edited December 2017
    ckall056 wrote: »
    which may help remove the 1-shot meta of PvP.


    Either you haven't pvped in about 2 months or you're playing a different game than me.

    If you know a secret to let you one shot all the current defenses PLEASE SHARE!
  • It would be nice if "the rest of us" could at least get some decent honor for the "lesser" leagues. I don't expect to be able to grind into the top 100 but the payout is sure lower down here.
  • Legend 1 can be a bother to achieve if you’re starting below Warlord 1, I grant you. However if you take a week that you have some spare time and make the push, it’s fairly easy to maintain. From there, you will start seeing improvement in the runes at your disposal, and suddenly what want once a difficult task becomes fairly straightforward and easy. You may not have duelist and champion runes on every hero on your roster, but really, you only need to have somewhere between four and ten heroes decked out at any given time (obviously the goal is eventually have more, so that you have more options and versatility - that comes with time). That was my experience, anyway.
  • @MattCauthron
    I tend to use the term 1-shot meta pretty loosely.
    Generally what I mean by this is not that an entire team is wiped, but that certain heroes [cough] Shade [cough] can and often do kill others in a single blow. I do not feel it is good for PvP or the game that matches are decided so quickly based on what one hero does.
    I know it opens up a lot of criticism about team selection and all, but when you are going against certain defense and the only thing you need is for Shade to NOT 1-shot that one hero, just to be able to have a chance, that seems like a poorly designed system. For the lower levels, the Shade-Hopper routine can be really tough to take on if enemy Shade always kills someone and you cant revive them.
    Once we get to a point where matches routinely last 8-10 turns (without Solaris), allowing most of our attackers to use their 2nd and 3rd skills, I think PvP will be much more engaging (and hopefully tactical).
    If at the very least we could stop seeing Koros or Shade 1-shotting people through Ferno's debuff, that'd be a start.
    www.youtube.com/DarthCraig
    www.twitter.com/Darth_Craig

    Are all plugs shameless?
  • lplzydecolplzydeco Member
    edited December 2017
    I suck at pvp. Highest I can get is to champion II. Last week I had a 12 streak & I thought i'd died & gone to heaven. The usual is 4 or 5 wins in a row. I don't know or understand the art of pvp-ing so I suck at it. I agree with the Solaris thing. Add a hopper & some good hits knocking out my Zomm & i'm a goner. My 70 level mostly Superior legendary runed Solaris, Zomm, Nub & fully loaded Grog can't win. Only one not 6 stars is Nub. And i'm a friggin loser. If I see a solaris/hopper combo, I avoid it & try to stay fighting 23000 (attack?) or lower opponents which relegates me to lesser honor fights. I hate pvp & only do it for my guild.
  • lplzydeco wrote: »
    I suck at pvp. Highest I can get is to champion II. Last week I had a 12 streak & I thought i'd died & gone to heaven. The usual is 4 or 5 wins in a row. I don't know or understand the art of pvp-ing so I suck at it. I agree with the Solaris thing. Add a hopper & some good hits knocking out my Zomm & i'm a goner. My 70 level mostly Superior legendary runed Solaris, Zomm, Nub & fully loaded Grog can't win. Only one not 6 stars is Nub. And i'm a friggin loser. If I see a solaris/hopper combo, I avoid it & try to stay fighting 2300 (attack?) or less opponents which relegates me lesser honor fights. I hate pvp & only do it for my guild.

    Used to hate pvp too, the teams i put together was based on if the hero looked cool or not. Then i grew up and started thinking of heroes that boost eachother. Not just passives; attacks too. For example, Hopper and mangle. Hopper makes the target tasty, and Mangle can usually take out the target if it isn't armored. Flesh shredder plus tasty makes for an insane 3x damage boost. They're both monsters too, so igorok's monstrous presence is pretty nice to throw into the mix.

    This works for me, but i'm just level 63, and this might not work on your level...

    Anyways, good luck!
    Level:65
    please send arcane evos
    Favorite Hero: Hopper
  • Thanks :) Guess i'll have to really study the heroes & see what I can see!
  • @lplzydeco - if you want to get better at pvp, join a better guild. This is not a recruiting pitch. The bottom line is, the top guilds consist of the top players, who generally share all their pvp knowledge in guild chat. By being in a top guild, you get the benefit of 49 other players figuring out the changes to the meta and sharing that knowledge collectively. Meanwhile, you may have a handful of guildmates who can pvp competitively, so your pvp knowledge gain is 10% of someone with the same roster, but in a better guild.

    Every player that joins AoA always has the same comment. "I had no idea how to pvp until I got here". I'm sure it's the same for FB, UW, LC, etc. Unless you are transferring between one of the top guilds, you will definitely notice a difference.
  • PvP is too much of a power creep. Worst part of dungeon boss in my opinion
  • Skip_HolmesSkip_Holmes Member
    edited December 2017
    @echonap is correct. Being in a good guild makes a big difference. But you have to be willing to dedicate the time necessary if you’re going to join one of those guilds. We can “make” you a decent PvPer, but you have to be willing.

    That said, if you want to remain casual yet still get some pvp advice, there are multiple pvp support groups in the Line app. Download that and we can send you invites to chats where you can ask questions or browse albums.
  • I think a secondary issue to not being heavily involved in pvp is that the sheer roster sizes and number of defensive makeups can feel intimidating. I can see how a newcomer would feel like they can’t possibly compete. In reality, top end pvp is doable with a very small number of heroes and good runes. Most of us are getting 95%+ win rates attacking without ever even changing our team up. There’s a couple attacking comps that steamroll most everything, and if you rune one of them decently, you don’t really need anything else at all (except time and gems) to get top 100 and drastically increase your reward payouts. But if you’re unaware of those comps or inexperienced in how to rune them, you probably get discouraged thinking you need superior runes on 30 different heroes to compete.
  • @Joel

    Intentional that they omitted a rune from the League rewards this week? This is the very definition of “rewards less useful”.
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