Tower since level cap increase, something has definitely changed.

sirtainlysirtainly Member
edited May 28 in Main Campaign Discussion
Up till the change, I could take the tower, even 9 solaris teams. I was figuring out barb teams.

Perhaps there are a few who understand the specific game mechanics needed and who have just the right runes in just the right places with just the right heroes to beat this, but it isn't me.

Yesterday a barb team around floor 9 or 10 ripped through my 3 goto tower teams and most of the rest of my roster. They seemed invincible.

Today a level 68 beast team on floor 10 took only about half damage from my beast-defeaters which last week would have cleaned their clock. After I came back with a second team they were fully healed. Right now I've used up all of my powerful heroes except my anti-barb team for the barb team sitting at floor 11.

Something has definitely changed -- now that my level 70's are on their way to 71, something about their hero opponents in tower has chaned.

and its making the tower uncompletable by me no matter what team I put together.
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Comments

  • PugsOfWarPugsOfWar Member
    You are not alone here. Keep your head up and hang in there. The tower is definitely showing some brutality nowadays. It took awhile but it hit me massively yesterday.
  • sirtainlysirtainly Member
    Day 3:

    Lost my first two tower teams by floor 8...my heroes seem weaker and tower teams of lower levels seem stronger, or maybe it was one too many Solaris/Drakk/Ferno +1 taunter team.

    Saw the shade-barb team up on floor 11 and since I'd already lost my shade I just gave up.

    Will -not- purchase extra gems to make up the difference in gems I won't win. Simply won't use gems as much in game.
  • StevusStevus Member
    The whole game is off balance. I'm advocating to postpone the upcoming pvp event until they balance this game out. The tower was a nightmare for me today, too. With the holiday weekend, I'm not confident theyll be able to address these issues before week's end.
  • I have a feeling it has something to do with the stat increase for 4, 5 and 6 stars. These stat changes were never fleshed out.
    3fzeyc8jfggy.jpeg
    • 4 Star: +40%
    • 5 Star: +60%
    • 6 Star: +100%
    Those should be the bonuses they now give.
    Crimson's Links: DB Wiki | DeviantArt | Minecraft Forum | Twitter
    IGN: CrimsonKid
    tgtu88snl2ot.png
  • What were the stat bonuses before the update?
  • phoxterphoxter Member
    My tower today, along with the normal 4 to 5 floors with the shade/barb defenders, it looks like they are granted almost unlimited energy and lives. My floor 11 was a level 71 shade/bard team. I killed Abigail and their shade immediately possessed Abigail. Of course my team gets wiped out quickly. So, the next attempt their shade immediately possessed Abigail,again, who was dead. This happened 3 more times I attempted to attack this floor after all my toons died. What the fudge? Is shade stuck on possession? I finally kill Abigail and then shade but again all my toons die. At this point I’m getting low on toons to attack with but I figure all I have to deal with is Balog. But when I attack again, Abigail is magicaly alive! And the Devs, in their great wisdom, have deactivated out energy runes because their supposedly far to powerful.

    The tower has become a sad joke.
  • YykkilYykkil Member
    I had to end tower early the each day the past 2 days, which I rarely had to do previously. Wouldn't be so bad if I didn't see the same cookie cutter meta teams over and over again...
    9807918
  • StevusStevus Member
    @Joel Can we get a comment on the Tower complaints?
  • BarleymanBarleyman Member
    What were the stat bonuses before the update?

    6* was a mysterious 63%. I forget exactly what the others were, but 5* I think was 51%.

    I can see how the stars might make the tower tougher if you don't have all the heroes you use at 6* yet.
  • MonkeyHunterMonkeyHunter Member
    edited May 29
    Barleyman wrote: »
    What were the stat bonuses before the update?

    6* was a mysterious 63%. I forget exactly what the others were, but 5* I think was 51%.

    I can see how the stars might make the tower tougher if you don't have all the heroes you use at 6* yet.
    Wow, so that’s a 22.7% stat boost for 6 stars after the update. Runes will magnify this effect. I wonder what the actual stat boost effects will be on 6-star heroes with full attack or full defense runes.
  • xandrew29xandrew29 Member
    Barleyman wrote: »
    What were the stat bonuses before the update?

    6* was a mysterious 63%. I forget exactly what the others were, but 5* I think was 51%.

    I can see how the stars might make the tower tougher if you don't have all the heroes you use at 6* yet.

    It was a 12.5% boost per star, but they don't show "0.5%"s so the value was shown as a the next whole number. At 6* it was a 62.5% boost, but it shows as a 63%. If you crunched the #s, the actual increase in stat values would be 62.5%.

    Tower is brutal. I'm not an elite whale, but I have over 1 million PvP trophies and am in the top 500 for lifetime PvP cups earned. I have over 40 6* heroes. I have multiple teams with 5* legendary superior runes and could regularly beat the tower with most of my main 16-20 heroes in tact (I try not to over level my roster for matchmaking reasons). Over the weekend, I faced a 4 barb team tower and made it to the end with 8 heroes. Today, I have a 5 barb team tower (of the dreaded Shalog variety) and I'm absolutely dreading getting through it.

    I don't think I'm an elite player, but I'd consider myself pretty good; I'm in a guild that consistently finishes in the top 10 for events (usually 7-10, but still) am always in L1 for the season and take the time to read the forums/see what people have planned. I save my resources, plan my runes out, etc.

    Barbs in the tower are just brutal. Abi alone can shred a team, and there are, as far as I am concerned, only 3 strats available:

    GT, Emily, Ferno Agnon
    GT, Shade, Agnon, Zomm
    GT, Agnon, Solaris, Ferno

    And each of them involves using GT to suck damage so you can use the rest of your abilities. If you lose your GT, you're SOL for the rest of the tower (which is why I love using him with Sol or Emily).

    You can wear the barbs down a bit (they don't naturally heal), but because runes carry over from PvP, I KNOW quite a few Balogs have those healer runes that give 10% HP regen each turn. Brutal.

    At least Solaris teams allowed you to work around the predictable patterns; with Rage having so few counters, you are completely out of luck if you lose just 1 piece of your puzzle. Your own barbs are usually good for 1, maybe 2 floors. This is worse than any Beast meta. I've been down to Balog and had him do his Bull Rush and wipe my team solo.
  • KalvynKalvyn Member
    I question whether this is the only change. I just looked at my primary team and confirmed they are all 6 star. If in fact the "star buff" is the sole reason for the difference, a team that was 6 star before the change should see no difference in difficulty level as both the attacking and defending team would have been buffed the same amount. I have clearly noticed that it takes more attacks to kill opposing tower teams and my hits do less damage after about level 7....regardless of the opposing team make up (barbs, beasts, etc).
  • echonapechonap Member
    Kalvyn wrote: »
    I question whether this is the only change. I just looked at my primary team and confirmed they are all 6 star. If in fact the "star buff" is the sole reason for the difference, a team that was 6 star before the change should see no difference in difficulty level as both the attacking and defending team would have been buffed the same amount. I have clearly noticed that it takes more attacks to kill opposing tower teams and my hits do less damage after about level 7....regardless of the opposing team make up (barbs, beasts, etc).

    Bad comparison. If previously the tower team had 1000 attack and your team had 900 attack, the difference is 100. Now that they increased the multiplier for stars, the 1000 attack went up by 30% to 1300 attack while yours went up 30% to 1170. Now the difference is 130.

    Changing the star multiplier further exaggerates differences in rune power.
  • lythstihllythstihl Member
    @Joel
    The most disappointing thing about the tower changes is when barbarians came out we anticipated what the problems would be when half the tower or more had barbarian groups. We got no comments from you or the devs. Then when the predictions started happening all the time we still got no comments from you or the devs. Now you upped the level cap and made it even worse. Maybe the issues above are stars but every one of my heroes is 6* and I don't seem to notice any difference for my heroes only for what I face in the tower.

    Today sandwiched between the 3 barbarian teams on levels 6, 7, and 8 and the barbarian team on level 10 I had a team with goretusk, koros, solaris, and grog-gnog, at level 73 (I am still 70) and with top of the line runes. They killed my first team but I managed to kill koros and GT and I consumed GT. I went back in with another team, just grog-gnog and solaris left. Only those 2 were there, no dead bodies. I couldn't damage them, they didn't have GT but somehow they had a ridiculous amount of damage reduction. They at through a pretty decent team and what happens... When I look at the floor in the tower all 4 are alive again. It was a miracle I got through them at all and still managed the next barbarian floor to be able to finish the tower. I have good runes on a good number of my heroes, all are level 70 and 6* but the tower is a challenge in an unfun way. Once upon a time in the days before runes there was a real strategy to the tower, different ways to do different floors, many groups that could work, and the whole strategy of baiting teams and how to best do it. I remember when I got the perfectionist badge and felt like it was actually an accomplishment (no runes, way fewer heroes, can't use bait, no resurrecting birds, no zombifying zomm, etc). Now you have to have specific teams and hope the RNG doesn't mess you up and make you lose a piece of the jigsaw that lets you beat barbarians or agnon or whichever. The tower was once the most fun part of the game and now its just something that feels frustrating even when I get through it.
    I can no longer decide from day to day what to think of this game.... and that is frustrating
  • lythstihl wrote: »
    @Joel
    The most disappointing thing about the tower changes is when barbarians came out we anticipated what the problems would be when half the tower or more had barbarian groups. We got no comments from you or the devs. Then when the predictions started happening all the time we still got no comments from you or the devs. Now you upped the level cap and made it even worse. Maybe the issues above are stars but every one of my heroes is 6* and I don't seem to notice any difference for my heroes only for what I face in the tower.

    Today sandwiched between the 3 barbarian teams on levels 6, 7, and 8 and the barbarian team on level 10 I had a team with goretusk, koros, solaris, and grog-gnog, at level 73 (I am still 70) and with top of the line runes. They killed my first team but I managed to kill koros and GT and I consumed GT. I went back in with another team, just grog-gnog and solaris left. Only those 2 were there, no dead bodies. I couldn't damage them, they didn't have GT but somehow they had a ridiculous amount of damage reduction. They at through a pretty decent team and what happens... When I look at the floor in the tower all 4 are alive again. It was a miracle I got through them at all and still managed the next barbarian floor to be able to finish the tower. I have good runes on a good number of my heroes, all are level 70 and 6* but the tower is a challenge in an unfun way. Once upon a time in the days before runes there was a real strategy to the tower, different ways to do different floors, many groups that could work, and the whole strategy of baiting teams and how to best do it. I remember when I got the perfectionist badge and felt like it was actually an accomplishment (no runes, way fewer heroes, can't use bait, no resurrecting birds, no zombifying zomm, etc). Now you have to have specific teams and hope the RNG doesn't mess you up and make you lose a piece of the jigsaw that lets you beat barbarians or agnon or whichever. The tower was once the most fun part of the game and now its just something that feels frustrating even when I get through it.

    I don't see perfectionist being possible at all now unless the person trying is very low level. Maybe the one where a single person has to survive may work... if someone can even survive that long.
  • PooombahPooombah Member
    phoxter wrote: »
    My tower today, along with the normal 4 to 5 floors with the shade/barb defenders, it looks like they are granted almost unlimited energy and lives. My floor 11 was a level 71 shade/bard team. I killed Abigail and their shade immediately possessed Abigail. Of course my team gets wiped out quickly. So, the next attempt their shade immediately possessed Abigail,again, who was dead. This happened 3 more times I attempted to attack this floor after all my toons died. What the fudge? Is shade stuck on possession? I finally kill Abigail and then shade but again all my toons die. At this point I’m getting low on toons to attack with but I figure all I have to deal with is Balog. But when I attack again, Abigail is magicaly alive! And the Devs, in their great wisdom, have deactivated out energy runes because their supposedly far to powerful.

    The tower has become a sad joke.

    Exact same thing happened to me earlier this week except worse, replace shade possessing Abigail in your scenario to koros, every team I brought it was one hit killed by the same possessed koros first ability over and over and over and over
  • Agreed, and weirdly enough I think tower is actually stronger then current pvp, I mean they deal more damage, they have more health, just doesn't make sense... And yes I'm talking before tournament not after, I got a sad joke for my tower today, floor one was barbs and I lost my entire rooster...
    All hail the Jabberwonky-JarJar,Jabber,Jibber
    May the side of fun and nonsense reign supreme!!
    Fun Is the most important aspect of games, don't underestimate future meta heroes...
  • echonapechonap Member
    I don't see perfectionist being possible at all now unless the person trying is very low level. Maybe the one where a single person has to survive may work... if someone can even survive that long.

    My tower yesterday consisted of 7 barb floors, including the last 5 in a row. I had a perfect tower.
  • @Joel
    There are a lot of threads regarding the drastically increased difficulty of the tower. I would appreciate a response regarding the issue.
  • echonap wrote: »
    I don't see perfectionist being possible at all now unless the person trying is very low level. Maybe the one where a single person has to survive may work... if someone can even survive that long.

    My tower yesterday consisted of 7 barb floors, including the last 5 in a row. I had a perfect tower.

    People keep saying they beat it... so how did you do it? Do you have one team that survives all of them or do you use a majority of your roster?
  • echonap wrote: »
    I don't see perfectionist being possible at all now unless the person trying is very low level. Maybe the one where a single person has to survive may work... if someone can even survive that long.

    My tower yesterday consisted of 7 barb floors, including the last 5 in a row. I had a perfect tower.

    People keep saying they beat it... so how did you do it? Do you have one team that survives all of them or do you use a majority of your roster?

    it's so obvious... everyone in their roosters are 6 stars, and fully runed with elite runes... only way!!! (Also all epics in the rooster are level 12)
    All hail the Jabberwonky-JarJar,Jabber,Jibber
    May the side of fun and nonsense reign supreme!!
    Fun Is the most important aspect of games, don't underestimate future meta heroes...
  • adoboadobo Member
    heh. roosters. lol
  • adoboadobo Member
    qNPE0IF.jpg
  • WasiWasi Member
    edited June 5
    echonap wrote: »
    I don't see perfectionist being possible at all now unless the person trying is very low level. Maybe the one where a single person has to survive may work... if someone can even survive that long.

    My tower yesterday consisted of 7 barb floors, including the last 5 in a row. I had a perfect tower.

    People keep saying they beat it... so how did you do it? Do you have one team that survives all of them or do you use a majority of your roster?

    it's so obvious... everyone in their roosters are 6 stars, and fully runed with elite runes... only way!!! (Also all epics in the rooster are level 12)

    I’m level 70 and have beaten every day to date, only have a few elite runes, including level 75 barb teams (although I’ve never had more that 4 barb teams in one tower day) using the same PvP teams as the recent guild games, using Emily, Agnon, Ferno and swapping out Solaris / Goretusk. I wish we could use 4th stats tho (inc. 2x festive runes on Emily).

    Tho would like some response from the devs on the issues / bugs... I had a dead shade come back to life among other issues.

    Edit - I don’t have any roosters tho... maybe that’s the problem with your roster?
    ---
    The Potato Army
  • echonapechonap Member
    it's so obvious... everyone in their roosters are 6 stars, and fully runed with elite runes... only way!!! (Also all epics in the rooster are level 12)

    Yes, mostly 6 star roster. But not even close to full elites. I don't have a single hero with more than 2 elite runes.

    It's all about intelligent roster management. Here is my strategy.

    1. Use Emily on first 1-2 floors until she has cleanse up. If you have a barb team on first floor, you need to use the anti barb teams immediately. See step 7.
    2. Against all barbs, use GT, one of Valkin/ Igo/ Selwyn, Ferno, and a big hitter. Freeze first normal, freeze team, drop wildfire on Balog, keep hitting whoever is burning to spread it.
    3. Against Shade barbs, use GT agnon emily ferno. Don't freeze anyone. Save GT freeze for scenario 2. Agnon plummets Shade, Emily cleanses silence, ferno drops wildfire on Drakk. Continue hitting whomever is burning to spread it. Take your time using basic attacks to give your team time to recharge.
    4. If there are floors in between, take advantage and drag Emily/Ferno/Agnon to recharge their skills.
    5. If back to back Shade barbs, use GT ekko emily ferno. If Emily has cleanse available, do not use Ekko's recharge yet. The key is always cleansing silence so that Ferno can spread wildfire. His first two moves can do it, so make sure one of them is always up.
    6. Do not freeze anyone unless you know you have time to recharge freeze again before next full barb floor. If you freeze someone, choose Abi if she goes first. Otherwise, choose Drakk. You want her frozen during Balog's turn so she does not follow up Cry Havoc with Dogs of War. If she goes second, this is not possible and you are only increasing rage.
    7. If cleanse is not available (too many back to back floors or early barb floors), use Shade barbs yourself. Your abi kills their shade, your shade links their abi, your balog silences, your drakk hits whomever has hp. Hopefully, by the end of round 1, everyone has IR up. However, since you killed their Shade and Abi, you go first so you can kill their Balog and Drakk before they get their second turn. A little luck involved here.
  • Rolla8Rolla8 Member
    Team makeups in the tower (mostly Barbarian teams) isn't the issue here in my eyes. The issue is the ridiculous runes that these teams appear to have on them.

    Before the "Grand" Tournament, the tower was tough at times, but beatable. For myself, every tower since the "Grand" Tournament has been impossible to beat, even for the most advanced accounts, such as my own.

    I am not sure what they did whenever they launched the "Grand" Tournament, but it appears to either have put Ultra runes on most tower floors, or to have messed with the damage formula for the tower. Either way, I think this is a much larger issue than the repeat of team compositions we have been seen repeating in the tower.
    o3etqqdlgz6l.jpg
  • Rolla8 wrote: »
    Team makeups in the tower (mostly Barbarian teams) isn't the issue here in my eyes. The issue is the ridiculous runes that these teams appear to have on them.

    Before the "Grand" Tournament, the tower was tough at times, but beatable. For myself, every tower since the "Grand" Tournament has been impossible to beat, even for the most advanced accounts, such as my own.

    I am not sure what they did whenever they launched the "Grand" Tournament, but it appears to either have put Ultra runes on most tower floors, or to have messed with the damage formula for the tower. Either way, I think this is a much larger issue than the repeat of team compositions we have been seen repeating in the tower.

    I agree with that too. I went through the first 10 floors easily enough with Agnon, Ferno, Zomm, Emily/Furnace/Other. Spent 20m gold to rune them. Thought this would be my first tower win since barbs. Then lost by 3 best teams (beasts, barbs, that tower team) to a Agnon Goretusk Emily Lily. I couldn't hurt Emily at all and she had the craftable healing rune and 10% HP each round rune. Lily got max stacked and Goretusk just game Emily DR the whole time. Obviously I couldn't focus anyone else because Emily would just bring them back with bonus energy. I didn't kill a single one since they healed so ******* much.
  • toothlessmontoothlessmon Member
    edited June 5
    Rolla8 wrote: »
    Team makeups in the tower (mostly Barbarian teams) isn't the issue here in my eyes. The issue is the ridiculous runes that these teams appear to have on them.

    Before the "Grand" Tournament, the tower was tough at times, but beatable. For myself, every tower since the "Grand" Tournament has been impossible to beat, even for the most advanced accounts, such as my own.

    I am not sure what they did whenever they launched the "Grand" Tournament, but it appears to either have put Ultra runes on most tower floors, or to have messed with the damage formula for the tower. Either way, I think this is a much larger issue than the repeat of team compositions we have been seen repeating in the tower.

    I agree with that too. I went through the first 10 floors easily enough with Agnon, Ferno, Zomm, Emily/Furnace/Other. Spent 20m gold to rune them. Thought this would be my first tower win since barbs. Then lost by 3 best teams (beasts, barbs, that tower team) to a Agnon Goretusk Emily Lily. I couldn't hurt Emily at all and she had the craftable healing rune and 10% HP each round rune. Lily got max stacked and Goretusk just game Emily DR the whole time. Obviously I couldn't focus anyone else because Emily would just bring them back with bonus energy. I didn't kill a single one since they healed so ******* much.

    Yep, and this tower inspired Someone to turn it into a pvp team, now I have no clean kills, meaning I have to fail raid 4 times to be able to get my crowns... I hate this, and if you think switching does a thing nope, I refreshed 8 times losing 400k gold before I lost hope.
    All hail the Jabberwonky-JarJar,Jabber,Jibber
    May the side of fun and nonsense reign supreme!!
    Fun Is the most important aspect of games, don't underestimate future meta heroes...
  • You've seen it in PVP? I've only been seeing Shade teams- some not Barbs.
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