Balog Silence, Solaris and Agnon

I have been playing this game for quite a while now to realize that you guys dont really like to nerf stuff. But hear me out on this one please. I run a Barb + Shade comp, and for the past 2 or 3 weeks i got beaten like less than 10 times total. Its like... i get attacked twice a day because people dont even bother going against me, and the ones that do get crushed. Every 5 or 6 days one guy beats me. Thats why i made this topic

Balog silence really needs a tone down. Its not really the damage itself but the time it lasts. Its way too long. Even with the comps that supposedly beat barb teams, sometimes i struggle really hard because of how long this thing lasts. It really needs to be reduced how long it lasts.

The other one is Solaris. There arent enough counters in the game for her. Not enough corpse eaters/removers, and the fact that her feathers start on every beast is just a major grievance. You either need to get her egg to not start at 3 stacks or remove the feathers at the beginning of the round. Beasts have their counters, more than barbs ill give you that, but they are still super powerful as it is, mainly because of how hard it is to remove them from the game. They have super high hp when on a full beast comp, and you have to go trough all that hp just to have them all ressed in one turn if you dont have luck on dispels.

The last one is Agnon. This guy is my major problem with the Tower game at the moment. He one shots any hero, high def or low def, no matter what. And he is super sturdy, even when runed for full attack. He needs a major change in his cooldowns if you are going to leave him as it is damage wise. His skills come back way too fast for how powerful they hit for. He either needs to have his damage toned down across the board or higher energy cost on his skills. He can literally solo teams.

I get it you dont feel like nerfing the heroes because well... people pay a lot of money in this game. But ill tell you... its super boring to play the game and feel it is utter imbalanced, to the point that if you have one of the op defenses, people wont even attack you. Something has to be done to these 3 champions.

Comments

  • williamwilliam Member
    edited August 10
    @Short_Fuse leave Solaris alone just purge her feathers and kill them hopper will take care of the rest and I use beast team against beast team and I usually win she has weaknesses agnon doesn’t need to be nerfed
  • You are certainly entitled to an opinion considering this is a suggestion forum. I dont agree tho
  • None of them need to be nerfed. Instead of asking them to nerf heroes, just strengthen your heroes and roster.
  • Short_FuseShort_Fuse Member
    edited August 10
    You havent read the topic... Thats fine. I have the defense team. I have 6k rune power almost. I dont think i need to strengthen it to be fair. I am saying my defense is so OP that its borderline boring. Nothing to do with what you just said.

    I clearly stated what i don´t agree with in the game considering this is a suggestion forum. Im not asking for game tips. You both said i need to l2p. Nothing to do with my topic. I am suggesting a balance. But hey its the internet... people last out opinions without really reading.

    You are certainly entitled to disagree with me but at least stay on topic. You can disagree with the reasons i gave on my post without assuming its a l2p issue. That would be fantastic. "Oh hey solaris doesnt need a nerf because she has x y and z counters thats fine by me". Yea... this is a reasonable opinion. What you guys did is just trolling
  • YykkilYykkil Member
    edited August 10
    I think Solaris is in a good place right now because her defensive AI is unintelligent (by design probably), meaning she will almost always take an action based on the circumstance (her chance of reviving is virtually 0 if there is at least 1 teammate left alive). Especially as she's getting more viable counters with all these older heroes getting reworks.

    Now Agnon, I definitely agree has too much kit. He's like the new Hanzo.
    9807918
  • That is quite true. Having to use festive runes on emily to dispel the balog silence annoys me a lot tho. I imagine how hard it is for people without them. On Agnon we both agree
  • Just jack hammer agnon and he is trash
  • YykkilYykkil Member
    william wrote: »
    Just jack hammer agnon and he is trash

    Having counters doesn't mean the hero isn't overtuned...
    9807918
  • StinkyStinky Member
    edited August 10
    When it comes to the barbs, I'm not sure the devs really grasped how much damage they can pump out on round one. Outside of a team that relies on mass resurrection (Solaris, Emily, Leo, +1), does anyone feel confident taking on Shade + barbs without Ferno and/or Goretusk in the group? I suspect the barbs were meant to be reliant on building up rage in order to be scary, but between the Abi + Balog combo attacks, Abi's shout, and Shade's Haunted, that's not really the case at all. Cry Havoc's silence is unpleasant, but it would make sense if any attacking team wasn't gutted after the first salvo.

    Failing that, do both Shade and Abi need to be fast?

    ---

    I could live with Agnon being able to murder everything if he wasn't a tank. Given how his damage multipliers mean you can afford to give him some defensive runes, he doesn't deserve Flying II (-50% damage taken from melee attacks) and Magical (-25% damage taken from non-Physical attacks). Graniteform and complete immunity to most debuffs in the game on their own make for a formidable defense. Rejigger the Flying trait so that it has three ranks: rank one gives a token amount of damage reduction against melee (5%?), rank two gives the 25% that the current rank one gives, and rank three gives the 50% that the current rank two gives. All the other fliers get upgraded so that there's no actual change for them when fully ascended, while Agnon alone gets stuck with Flying I at max ascension.
  • Stinky wrote: »
    ...I could live with Agnon being able to murder everything if he wasn't a tank...

    He's actually a warrior but I know what you mean, he acts like a tank.

    What level are you Stinky, and what level are your attackers?

    I've fielded the Shade + Barbs team and gotten beaten plenty. I usually lose to this team when Balog's shout is super-runed for attack and it kills or shreds my team.

  • StinkyStinky Member
    edited August 10
    Barleyman wrote: »
    Stinky wrote: »
    ...I could live with Agnon being able to murder everything if he wasn't a tank...

    He's actually a warrior but I know what you mean, he acts like a tank.

    What level are you Stinky, and what level are your attackers?

    I've fielded the Shade + Barbs team and gotten beaten plenty. I usually lose to this team when Balog's shout is super-runed for attack and it kills or shreds my team.

    I'm 70, and usually field 70s now unless I get cocky/lazy/complacent, which is more often than I'd care to admit. I'm usually fighting 74s at the moment. Like you, I'll get wiped out by a Balog nuke every now and again. I don't have an Emily with energy runes, so I rune Ferno mostly aggressively and have Emily res him after he inevitably dies in the opening round.
    Post edited by Stinky on
  • Wait a minute it wasn’t long ago they buffed balog why should they nerf him so soon
  • Short_FuseShort_Fuse Member
    edited August 10
    I have a little game changer on my defense. My Balog runs the tank rune, meaning my Shade isnt susceptible to getting one shotted on turn 1. So it makes the defense that much harder, considering my shade has close to 6k skill and doesn't get one shotted by most aoe attacks they get off on turn 1. (Skill buffs his passive)

    I am aware that the tank rune changes the team dynamic a bit, considering killing Shade on turn 1 is usually what people need to do to be sucessful beating the Shalog comp. But still, i think his silence lasts too long. I could be a hypocrite and say i am great at this game or whatever people do on the forums when people call for nerfs, but i am quite aware the champions i am using are op and i have great runes on them. And thats pretty much it. I am at level 74 and the lowest defense rating i´ve ever had in 3 or 4 weeks has been 94% win rate, just so you know how op this comp is.
  • RocksorRocksor Member
    edited August 10
    Well if Mk is any indication of a nerf gone wrong, it's best to stay from nerfing heroes. That was double work right there, one to nerf because folks called for it for over a year, and then a revamp 10 months later because the folks didn't like the nerf.
  • StinkyStinky Member
    Short_Fuse wrote: »
    I have a little game changer on my defense. My Balog runs the tank rune, meaning my Shade isnt susceptible to getting one shotted on turn 1. So it makes the defense that much harder, considering my shade has close to 6k skill and doesn't get one shotted by most aoe attacks they get off on turn 1. (Skill buffs his passive)

    I am aware that the tank rune changes the team dynamic a bit, considering killing Shade on turn 1 is usually what people need to do to be sucessful beating the Shalog comp. But still, i think his silence lasts too long. I could be a hypocrite and say i am great at this game or whatever people do on the forums when people call for nerfs, but i am quite aware the champions i am using are op and i have great runes on them. And thats pretty much it. I am at level 74 and the lowest defense rating i´ve ever had in 3 or 4 weeks has been 94% win rate, just so you know how op this comp is.

    I'm kinda interested in what your replays are like. My own defense is an Emily/Agnon one and has been since my own Shade + barbs defense started to lose more and more fights, so I can't see for myself. Well, not without re-runing my barbs and hoping they beat someone, anyway. When you successfully defend a dungeon, does your team not shred most attackers by the time round one's finished?
  • Ferno + GT teams usually last a lot longer than turn 1, but unless their Emily has Festive runes, they usually die by the time the silence runs off. This is why i think the silence lasts too long...
  • MaxBeamerMaxBeamer Member
    edited August 10
    You say stay on topic and your topic is about your Barb- Shade defense, well SolAris and Agnon aren’t on that team. But okay you want to make it about other people being not able to beat you then here we go.
    None of them needs to be nerfed, OTHER people need to strengthen their heroes and roster.
    Post edited by MaxBeamer on
  • I really love the idiots who say "Hit agnon with jackhammer and he's dead". You do realize that jackhammer doesn't ignore granite form right. First, you have to purge granite form, then makes sure a taunt isn't active, make sure hagrim is still ALIVE, then use jackhammer and kill Agnon. It's not that simple. Agnon NEEDS a nerf. Either those cooldowns get a boost or nerf his damage multipliers, because I think it's flat out stupid for anyone to do 2x 20x 10x damage and do it again in 3 rounds.
  • This is far worst than Invicible Bauble/Emily, because atleast they didn't hit like a monster truck.
  • StinkyStinky Member
    Deathriftx wrote: »
    I really love the idiots who say "Hit agnon with jackhammer and he's dead". You do realize that jackhammer doesn't ignore granite form right. First, you have to purge granite form, then makes sure a taunt isn't active, make sure hagrim is still ALIVE, then use jackhammer and kill Agnon. It's not that simple. Agnon NEEDS a nerf. Either those cooldowns get a boost or nerf his damage multipliers, because I think it's flat out stupid for anyone to do 2x 20x 10x damage and do it again in 3 rounds.
    In addition to this, Agnon and Ferno get along like a house on wildfire. Have fun attacking Agnon not only through graniteform, but Ferno's -attack debuff.
  • hey topicstarter. what ur in game nick? and where guild ya from? can't wait to rob ur dungeon
    ____
    TNT
  • StinkyStinky Member
    edited August 11
    Short_Fuse wrote: »
    Ferno + GT teams usually last a lot longer than turn 1, but unless their Emily has Festive runes, they usually die by the time the silence runs off. This is why i think the silence lasts too long...
    Oh well, I guess our experiences are just that different. I can usually work around the silence nowadays because there are lots of heroes that are silence immune (Emily, Agnon, Valkin) or can still do some work through the silence (GT, Ferno, Zomm). The problem for me is Balog's damage combined with his survivability. Even if you stall Balog's Havoc so that it doesn't line up with Abi's Shout, he's probably gained some rage by then and will do bonus damage anyway.

    Presumably the idea behind Deadeye was that Solar Shot could be used to derail an Agnon or Balog's turn one despite debuff immunity, but it doesn't really do the job because both of those heroes will simply murder you in round two. The Balog didn't have the tank rune in this video, either, which like you say, only makes the fight harder.



    Luckily, most people don't rune their Balogs with attack, instead pumping them up with def. This is probably why my win rate is usually in the ~90% area. If more people rolled with Darth Balog then I'd be in trouble.
  • hatredhatred Member
    MaxBeamer wrote: »
    None of them need to be nerfed. Instead of asking them to nerf heroes, just strengthen your heroes and roster.
    While I agree these heroes do not need nerfs, just because something is beatable does not mean it was balanced or healthy for the game. Old MK was beatable sure but he was basically autoinclude and his rework resulted in a hero that is still quite useful but is no longer an autoinclude, and is far healthier for the game.
  • Kira pre-nerf was a team killer. They could revert him now because now it won't be so much of a problem due to this era's new definition of OP.
    but he was still a problem, because he could kill tanks simply with Death Blossom
  • Is Rocky supposed to be able to silence Solaris? I thought she was immune to spirit attacks?
  • Is Rocky supposed to be able to silence Solaris? I thought she was immune to spirit attacks?

    Nope, Rocky should not be able to silence Solaris since she is immune to all spirit attacks. Sonic Screech is a spirit based attack.
  • Ok well it's broken then lol. Everyone you can all Silence that pesky buffalo wing using Rocky :)
  • For sol I use goretusk, agnon, and zomm
    Goretusk freezes, Agnon will do a lot of dmg surprisingly. And zomm can remover her.
  • crustysnailcrustysnail Member
    edited August 31
    Interesting I find barb + shade teams very easy minus the odd mishap or fear. Shade, Goretusk, agnon and Zomm. Spirit link Drakk, freeze Abigail with Goretusk, agnon Plummet shade... then take out balog shade first skill. Then when he is glowing take out Abigail until balog glow gone - finish him then Abigail. Sorted

    Good results barbs + anyone. Slightly different approach with boiler guy tank dude.
  • DevilJhonsDevilJhons Member
    edited September 3
    agree, agnon totally need nerf, he is not okay, too much def and atck, even beast teams looks nice in compare, but they also need nerf, barbs deals tons of dmg, and have good def/dr/atck stats with fear immune and x2 x2 bonuses, they hit so much, that assasins with dr and dodge bufs die from 2 hits,(from 20 attacks in one round) for me it's obvious that some heroes are op, when their game counters can do nothing, at first they were fun to play, now i dont use barbs, couse it's unfair to other players and don't need them on every flour in tower. Even shade not such pain in the as* as agnon, if u can't nerf him, remove him from game, with any hero tokens compensation as exchenge. I just can't understand, why from all heroes in game only 15-20 playble (or op) why only 2-3(franklyspeaking only 1 can,others 2 just try) heroes can remove corpses, why some teams need specific counters and others doesn't have any, or every team member has counter to other team, like perfect swing vs assasins, come on, they dont have so much atck/def stats and legendary hero to be countered so hard, any dwarf can 1 shot any assasin, but no one can 1 shot agnon or barbs, or goretusk in beast team(except agnon), make all teams powerful enough, or make nerf to most powerful, we want rock paper scissors, not car without wheels, truck , more bigger truck.
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